95: Safety News, Violation Statistics, and Trucking Accident Verdicts

During this week’s episode of the Oakley Podcast, host Jeremy Kellett is joined by Jeremy Paul and Dustin Barnett from Oakley’s safety department to discuss trucking safety concerns, accidents Oakley has had, and more. 

Key topics in today’s conversation include:

  • Oakley Update: clean cut appearance policy, expiring physicals, owner-operator recognition (2:49)
  • Canadian vaccine mandate (6:50)
  • Accident trends (9:14)
  • Recruiting (12:15)
  • CSA violations: speeding and tires (15:24)
  • Geotabs (21:19)
  • Oakley accidents (24:57)

Oakley Trucking is a family-owned and operated trucking company headquartered in North Little Rock, Arkansas. For more information, check out our show website: podcast.bruceoakley.com.


Automated transcription – may contain errors

Jeremy Paul  00:12

Many owner operators we get out there as much as you know many inspections we do get, we’re looking at 66% of our owner operators have zero CSI points. That’s, that’s a fantastic, fantastic number and then you’ve got 22% at one to 15, which is still good 16 to 37.6%. So that’s some really good numbers there to see.

Jeremy Kellett  00:34

Welcome to the Oakley podcast, trucking, business and family. This show is brought to you by Oakley trucking headquartered in North Little Rock, Arkansas. The purpose of this podcast is to communicate with Oakley owner operators and their families by giving them up to date information concerning Oakley trucking and the trucking industry. From business advice to safety updates to success stories, also to give an insight to outside truck drivers that might be interested in joining the Oakley family. This Jeremy Keller, Director of recruiting here, dopey trucking, and I’m your host for this podcast. This is episode 95. So on this week’s episode, we’re gonna sit down with JP and Dustin Barnett from the safety department from Oakley safety department. And we’re going to talk some different things here. We’re going to talk a little bit about some of the safety concerns that’s going on in trucking in general real quick. And then we’re also going to talk about some accidents that Oakleys had and the outcome of accidents and we’re going to touch on just some safety concerns with a CSA and a little bit everything but I want to encourage you to listen to this whole thing because you know, it’s it’s gonna be a good one it gets even better towards the end. So Y’all stay tuned and listen to that. But first, before we get started, let’s do an Oakley update which is sponsored by aero truck sales. Keith Wilson at Aero truck sales in Springfield, Missouri is currently offering $1,000 off your first month’s payment when you finance with transport funding, or $1,000 off the truck price if you bring your own financing. They’re also discounting the cost of an extended warranty by $500. Arrow truck sales has been a longtime partner with Oakley trucking, and that’s because they specialize in first time truck buyers. They don’t do any leases. They have the best use trucks money can buy because used trucks is all they do. They don’t sell any new trucks. And the biggest reason that arrow and Oakley are partners is service after the sale. It is very important to us at Oakley that when we refer you to a company that they are a good company with good people they do what they say and they understand our requirements. So give Keith a call at 573-216-6047 for a good use truck and tell him you heard about it on the Oakley podcast. Okay, a couple things on the Oakley update I want to talk about first. The one important thing that I know is a challenge for a lot of people but I want to explain it real quick. Real quick is our clean cut appearance policy that we have at Oakley trucking. You know we require by be clean shaven haircut looking the part? Well, it’s not just being clean shaven and haircut. It is a whole package of what you look like it is what you act like it is your language at our shippers and receivers. It is the attire you have on when you roll out of your truck and add our shippers and receivers or anywhere you know it’s do you have your PPE on and all these places? It is what is your truck look like? What is your trailer look like? It’s the whole deal. And we have a strict clean cut appearance policy at Oakley and we’re very proud of it. And we will my sure buddy you know sometimes we have to have a refresher on this clean cut appearance and it’s something that I want you to know it goes a long ways you guys that that have service as a priority. You actually produce a lot of fruit for yourself. So keep it up you guys that are doing it all the time. Please keep it up and we appreciate you doing it. But clean cut appearance is something that stands out here at Oakley we’re well known for. The other thing is I was talking to and you guys might get into this later, but I was talking real quick to Ashley. And she said to be sure and let all the owner operators know about the physicals that are expired. Listen, we’ve talked about this before on this episode on this podcast, you’ve got to get your physicals done before two days before it expires. That we’re having med surg problems where you have to send in the physical to the state was it’s not just like that it doesn’t turn around that quick so actually says man get your physicals at least a week or two early before it expire. So keep that in mind when you’re going to renew your physical know about that. Also on the Oakley update, I’d like to recognize an owner operator and this week I would like to recognize Mr. Larry Childress has been with us 15 years. Doesn’t seem that long, but he has been great owner operator force he he runs the little rocks Oklahoma City run all the time and does a great job. I know. I was asking his dispatcher about him and he said when he said he likes to fish, so he must be a really good guy. But and then also he said he was gonna retire like five years ago. And we offered him this room to go back and forth to 3am to Oklahoma City, Lew Rockwell calm city, and instead of retiring, that’s what he does for us. And Brian, his dispatcher says he loves to call him and give him a hard time every morning love to joke and kid with him and when he’s on the phone, and he helped brighten his day. So good. Good stuff from Brian and Larry gilas. We appreciate you being with Oakley trucking, he, I forgot. I usually mentioned what kind of truck they have. And I actually forgot what kind of truck he has a yellow Peterbilt. I know it was he used to have that yellow Peterbilt but sorry about that label. Get that. Get that back out there sometime. Appreciate you. You’re always you’re an asset, totally truck. And we thank you for being with us this long. Okay, guys, let’s get into some safety stuff. And one thing I wanted to discuss with some of the top stuff going on in the safety world in trucking right now, and there’s a lot of stuff out there right now and coming in 2022. You know, what, some of the top? Well, first of all, we got JP JP has been with us. Both you guys been on the podcast before, right? Yeah. Yeah. So I got JP here, get Dustin Barnett here. They’re from the safety department. And appreciate you guys joining me on this and knocking this out this morning to get it done. Because everybody needs to hear from the safety department and know what’s going on and priority there because sometimes they don’t want to hear from a safety. And I’m hoping this this podcast helps to you know, make that relationship better. So they actually contact the safety department. But before we get into Oakley stuff, what’s going on at in the safety world right now? JP?

Jeremy Paul  06:49

Well, you know, we just mentioned a little bit for walking in here, gentlemen, but Canadian vaccine mandate that really take effect here recently, it’s been a big topic of discussion across drivers across the world. And what we’re seeing is basically they’re gonna require proof of vaccination when crossing into Canada. And I got a few facts here on it, you know, they’re estimating from the American Trucking Association, you’re looking only about 50 to 60% of us truckers are vaccinated. And so he would believe that’s gonna cause a little disruption in supply chain. Like there’s already not enough out there as it is. But, you know, a saw word that said the cost of transporting produce out of California and Arizona and Canada just jumped 25% as of last week due to this. So they’re already seen a little bit of effect. So

Jeremy Kellett  07:34

I was reading an article yesterday on that. And it was was Schnatter is pulling out of Canada. Really? Yeah, they got a big terminal there. And somewhere in Canada, I forgot the name of the place but it’s their season their operation in Canada. Wow. I don’t know if it’s got to do with the, the vaccine thing, right? I just read that on news. And I thought man, it’s pretty big now your CSUN operation? Yeah,

Jeremy Paul  07:57

that’s a big campus a big company. We

Jeremy Kellett  07:59

do it for sure.

Jeremy Paul  08:00

Absolutely. What else yet? And you know, with that, I mean, that’s estimated about 12,000 drivers prohibited from entering the US from their side too. So that means like we said, it’s gonna be a little bit of disruption but it’s also going to affect our owner operators. You know, we you know, our pneumatics go into Canada and we we need to be able to go into Canada so that being said, you know, that Mac owner operator doesn’t have it we need to be focused on getting that vaccines we can get into Canada and get that freight done.

Jeremy Kellett  08:27

Yeah, there’s a lot of freight that we do goes in and out again, I was talking to the pneumatic guys I felt like they they already gotten they’re ahead of the game. They’ve already got a list where button I think almost everybody’s is good to go. You know that that runs Canada. We actually in my head might know before this episode even comes out, but we were talking about paying more you know, yeah, cross border and doing that. So paying the owner operator more so let’s very well might happen it might happen before this even comes out but good deal. What else? What do you got born? What’s going on in the safety world?

Dustin Barnett  09:02

Well, my main focus is accident related. So I can speak a little bit on kind of some trends we’ve seen here recently maybe some uptick on preventable accidents and the causes of those accidents and what what we’ve seen is lane changes and whenever we look at the data and we look at the the styles of trucks most of them are those long nose you know, Peter Kay, who know what we’re seeing, and number two pretty boring. Yeah, no nice trucks. I have them on my background screen on my computer downstairs. But that’s what we’re seeing mostly and a lot here recently are actually what’s your say Lane ins so instead of you know, slowing down, creating some separation and traffic trying to get over prior to that lane ending, they’re kind of forced to make a split decision. They’re in that left lane, it’s ending they can either take the shoulder in the road, or they can try to force over into the right hand lane and you know, our guy or the arc four wheelers are in right operators in, really, you look at it and they had plenty of time, the other driver had plenty of time to slow down, they saw our guys blinker on, you know, do the polite thing he’s trying to get in the lanes ending. But nowadays, we’re seeing that this common courtesy becoming less and less. And even amongst other trucking companies, you know, when I was talking to a gentleman that had one and he said, Look, I’ve been out here a long time. And usually, you know, when you see somebody in need, and hey, the lanes in and I need over they, you know, do what they can to allow and prevent an accident. But nowadays, they’re speeding up trying to block him in. And we just need to be mindful of create that separation prior to that lane. And when you see that sign engine,

Jeremy Kellett  10:41

you’re right. You are true in saying that the common courtesy is gone. So I was quick story. I was going home the other day on our 40. And we’re crystal Hill runs out. It’s before the 430 split right there. Well, there’s a I’m in the middle of this truck. And I mean, he he has he don’t I don’t know if he didn’t see me or what but I’m kind of in the middle of his trailer. And I don’t. He turned his blinker on and he’s coming. Oh, no, he don’t. He didn’t care where I was at. I don’t know if he didn’t see me because, I mean, it almost was closest, Rick in a long time. Because, yeah, I had to, I had to try to slam on the brakes. But he was kept coming over. And then there was somebody on my side on the left side of me. So luckily, they helped me and they hit the shoulder unable to get out of his way back in the car. I mean, you know, I mean, it’s a it’s a bad situation, but it’s kind of situation like that, because Wayne was running out. And he just said, I’m coming, you got to get out of my way, which is, you know, put a little road rage in me. But, you know, I was trying to get as the name off the door, you know, hold my phone as I’m driving by I’m trying to take a picture and I can’t get it, you know, and it was a blurry anyway. But finally, I calmed down a little bit, but you’re not common courtesies is gone these days, when it comes to that stuff

Dustin Barnett  12:03

is you know, you see a blinker and you see a guy trying to change lanes. And normally you’d slow down and kind of lead but in this case, they’ve been speeding up blocking them, either running them off the shoulder of the road, or causing them to come over what’s gonna

Jeremy Kellett  12:15

happen when these 18 year olds getting trucks. Do you see that apprentice program or the pilot program? I did? Yeah. Did we all think about that?

Jeremy Paul  12:23

I think it’s a good opportunity to get more guys on the road, I guess, you know, the shortage we’ve talked about for years now. But I don’t really have too many thoughts on it. You know, he also might, that might cause insurance rates to go up if you start diving off into it. And, you know, what, do you think more now you get anything on it? Yeah,

Dustin Barnett  12:43

I think it plays a big factor. I think it’ll help in recruiting more, you know, with the shortage, but I think it will play a factor in insurance rates and the likeliness to get liability insurance over the road with less experienced drivers. But overall, I think if with the proper training, and I’m sure as it gets, you know, more and more 18 year olds get into the program that will determine

Jeremy Kellett  13:08

will this is the over the road. I mean, they can drive now just intrastate, you know, right. So this is just allowing them to drive girl. Yeah, girl state lines, which has been argued for years on, you know, walking when we let the guy drive across state line, you know, when it’s obviously there’s no worse in certain situations of the country, you know, where it would help. So I mean, you know, they’re out there now doing intrastate. Yeah. And I think, I mean, I’m, I’m all for it getting more people in the drug driving industry, man, you send these 18 year olds, a big argument always is you, you know, you you’ll send them to the army or the Marines or whatever, to defend your country, put them in a, in a jet, a tank or whatever, you know, and let them operate that. I mean, it’s a little different. But you, you know, you put a lot of faith and confidence in them to do that. Like, yeah, we can’t, you know, they can’t get approved to drive a truck across state line. So, yeah, we’ve

Jeremy Paul  14:05

seen a lot of owner operators talk about that, too, you know, maybe, and you get kind of mixed feelings from them. You know, a lot of your older hands have been driving for a long time and like, well, that’s when I started driving a farm truck at seven so Asian, I was really young, you know, for CDL required, and you get some owner operators, like, well, it seemed like a little hazard there. So he kind of mixed opinions from Yeah,

Jeremy Kellett  14:23

I think it’d be good. I mean, you know, maybe they won’t be set in their way so much, you know, yeah. And a little easier to train when they’re, when they’re that young to do it. But there’s a lot of I was reading this pilot program. There’s a lot of stipulations on this. You know, somebody’s got to be in the truck with you. That’s got so much experience, they got to be so old and then they got to do so many hours of training. There’s quite a bit of stipulations go into it. It’s not just a stepping stone drive and internal blues. There’s it’s that’s not happening. It’s yeah, but yeah, that’s that’s good. Okay, some good stuff there. What about we touched a little bit on lane change what else is going on with the Oakley safety department needs to communicate to Oakley owner operators.

Jeremy Paul  15:07

Well, I guess I wanted to hit on a little bit of CSI stuff and kind of go over that. Yeah. And I know, Barnett wanted some more accident stuff too. But I guess we can talk about the CSA,

Jeremy Kellett  15:17

CSA and then touch quickly on the Geotab. Okay, we’ll finish with those accidents we were talking about. That sounds good.

Jeremy Paul  15:23

So with our CSA, you know, I think last time Ian Barnett were on the podcast. Jeremy, we talked about this a lot. And you know, that CSA threshold and us kind of being right there at the threshold for unsafe. And currently, we’re, we’re still right there on the borderline of the we actually did really good around November. We got it down below threshold. So that was good to see. But December picked us right back up and put a shot back there at the threshold. So

Jeremy Kellett  15:48

in the unsafe category. So yes, a What does that include?

Jeremy Paul  15:52

That is going to be you know, unsafe, makes it go up and down? Yes, that’s a good question. So that would be actually a DOD officer pulling our drivers over and issuing them a roadside violation on level 123456 Or seven inspection with an unsafe moving violation. And those would be things like speeding 610 speeding 1114 Speeding construction, improper lane, change no seatbelt, and that things are a few others out there. That’s the first ones that come to mind.

Jeremy Kellett  16:18

This one is happening the most. Yes, sir. Now,

Jeremy Paul  16:20

you know, last year I looked at the past 24 months and our top three unsafe violation roll different speed things, you know, we speeding six to 10 speeding 11 to 14 speeding in construction where our top three violations for unsafe and those combined to give us an Oakleys drivers 860 CSA points between those three violations alone. And

Jeremy Kellett  16:44

so even is just you know, ever since saying I don’t want it to say bad about it. But ever since it seemed like we put in those Qualcomm’s I went to those electronic logs and you know, the time just takes it’s seen it just yeah, just send it to us puts people in a hurry. You know, when that clock’s ticking all day, and they trying to get all the work done? I mean, I can I can see or it can absolutely sure.

Jeremy Paul  17:09

And while we’re really concerned about that, too, I mean, FMCSA actually came out and said Here recently that they’re going to send out warning letters to carriers that are at a 50% unsafe basic threshold. So 50%, it’s obviously a lot lower than what the threshold is set at 65. But the reason why they’re saying they’re doing that is they’re trying to be more proactive versus reactive. So trying to get on top of it. And they basically said, you know, if you get this letter and you don’t see, and they don’t see an improvement in your percentile ranking, then you’re going to set yourself up for more focused audits, compliance reviews.

Jeremy Kellett  17:42

So we’re expecting a letter think we’ve already made.

Jeremy Paul  17:45

Yeah, so that’s why we’re really trying to focus on getting that down and getting a handle on it. And I’ll tell you, our guys can really just help us out in my personal opinion, Bob, not speeding in Arkansas, it seems like we’ve we had a lot of speeding, you know, handle a lot of our violations me and actually do our roadside inspections. And I feel like a lot of the spacings I see are in Arkansas. So we run we run, we run a lot in Arkansas. So it would make sense. But just watching out for that. And another one that’s really hit us pretty hard. And this is not unsafe. This is just another violation that I see very often. And that’s usually under the vehicle maintenance basic. But in that top violation, there’s called a tire and or audible air leak. And I feel like 95% of time and I see that violation, they usually get put out of service when they receive it. And that’s basically the DoD officer saying you’re one of your tire just too flat, or it is flat, or it’s just too low, to be considered a flat. And we’ve seen that a lot. And my recommendation are guys is within our industry in this job what we do, you know, we need to be just doing tire checks every time we stop, you know, there’s no reason why we can’t just step out of the truck, take a few minutes to put a gauge on it.

Jeremy Kellett  18:54

So give me an example of one of our guys that calls you and what did the what did the DLT officer roadmap for I mean,

Jeremy Paul  19:03

that was what the so there’s an actual federal code and it’s called I can’t remember the actual code but it’s a the actual violation itself is described as a tire and or audible air leak. And essentially, that just means either your tire can be low enough to be

Jeremy Kellett  19:17

don’t have a spacesuit you can’t remember one like our driver said, No, you know, it was Yeah, I had a flat tire. And he wrote me up for a flat tire or

Jeremy Paul  19:26

yeah, there’s two I can think of so when our operator told me that he he knew he did have a flat and he only had like two miles to go until he got to the shop to get it fixed. And in that two miles Sure enough, he ended up getting stopped by an officer. So he went ahead and took the risk and I just told him you know with my recommendation with our CSA, and our CSA Pit Paste it up the way it is, and it was actually on the trailer. Now obviously it is gonna be more of a calls for a road call. But I think we would rather go ahead and pave that road call for that two mile period, then rather risk our guy getting see CSA points. Yeah, for installation. And the other one I could think of that happened recently owner operator just said, I had to take my tire flip out of the facility, I had to just pick something up on the road. And I guess at that point, it is hard to avoid, you know, if you don’t hear see something, feel something, and maybe you did pick up something that is leaks down. But

Jeremy Kellett  20:20

unfortunately, well, that’s that’s frustrating, because, you know, the I know, they try to you try to prevent that. And oh, man, it’s so hard when you mean, as you know, when everything’s good when you take off, but when you you know, as you’re going down the road stuff happens. And then you get caught and it’s just frustrating.

Dustin Barnett  20:39

It’s hard to explain to an officer to Yeah, yeah, I did my pre trip it was aired up and now it’s not he’s Yeah, he’s not, he doesn’t take an effect for taking account that it could have happened. Oh, yeah. mile stretch, but he’s still got

Jeremy Kellett  20:52

all those air leaks. I mean, I could imagine how hard it is to find those now, especially if you got a slow one. Oh, my. Yeah. So that’s some of your top violations of speeding.

Jeremy Paul  21:03

That actually was our top four those, you know, those three speed things, which ones and tires. Those are, were our top four violations altogether. So

Jeremy Kellett  21:10

that’s what our guys need to focus on right now. Yes, sir. wading into speeds and tires. Okay, that’s been our biggest ones. Okay. Well, how the Geotab going?

Jeremy Paul  21:20

going really good? Didn’t they give us kind of credit for how many we’ve installed?

Dustin Barnett  21:25

Yeah. So we were talking with TrueNorth, our liability insurance carrier just in a meeting that we had scheduled. And they’ve made reference, they said, they’re kind of keeping up with our rollout. And they said they are involved in here have a lot of carriers that are kind of transferring over to a new telematics system. And they’re kind of Raven tip about okay, they said, they haven’t seen the rate and efficiency that Oakley has been pushing these out. And I think that says a lot about, you know, our company, it says a lot about earner operators, between safety and dispatch, coordinating them in here. And then of course, all the shop guys out there doing their job on, on getting those installed whenever you can, you can install 12 a day. It’s kind of what we’re shooting for. That keeps them busy out there. But it also says a lot about the fist and the efficiency and how we

Jeremy Kellett  22:12

conduct ourselves. Well, and I hear Jason way of hollering out there. Yeah, yeah, he’s been getting in here and get to get these things done, which is good, and does a great point on the shop after being able to get them all done.

Jeremy Paul  22:23

That’s what I think our owner operator state for being receptive to this and taking the time to be able to let us make this change and making it easier on us, you know, they’ve been very helpful and going forward with it, sit there in the class, ask their questions, they do learn it. And

Jeremy Kellett  22:37

it’s what’s the feedback you get now that we’ve got over 500? And what kind of feedback you’re getting pretty good overall,

Jeremy Paul  22:44

overall. So I say I mean, everybody’s saying, obviously, that first week of using it, you’re a little frustrated, because it’s a different system. But you know, following up with our guys, and then using that new system, after they’ve learned it, they really enjoy it because it is now I think it’s an overall easier system, once you get the hang of things is

Jeremy Kellett  22:57

the iPad, the way to go or your phone.

Dustin Barnett  23:01

We’re seeing it varied, I think we’re seeing more. So if they do start with the phone, they’re investing in an iPad or tablet later on just because it’s a larger screen, they can view the graph a little easier and just keep keep their personal phone off to the side and just use their device for logging. And they leave it installed in their trucks. And that’s all they use it for.

Jeremy Paul  23:20

And I probably would Jeremy if I was if I was driving force and knowing the system outright use a pad just because you can see everything on one screen phone works definitely fine. So I don’t want to push anybody to spend money if they don’t want to. But it is easier on pad to see everything.

Jeremy Kellett  23:32

I was talking, you know, you hear some guys that they don’t give their phone to the deal to you. Oh, yeah, I get that. Well, I happen to I was I’ve had a lieutenant Doug Lafferty on here a couple times. And matter of fact, I called him the other day. And I said, I gotta get you back on here. Yeah. He said, Yeah, anytime I’d be great. And we might get him in here and one of you guys and bounce things back and forth. But yeah, he said, I mentioned it to him about we were going through this and a lot of guys didn’t want to let a DLT officer look at their phone. He said, I can just tell you, I don’t want to look at their phone. I don’t want to see anything in their phone. You know what’s going on. He said that’s the last thing I want to do is go through the stuff on their phone, you know, I just need to see the logs and that so yeah, it’s the same same deal. But that work to do there. That’ll be a future show. Maybe in the next few weeks. We’ll get him up here. And maybe do a little q&a with the safety department and the DLT officer.

Dustin Barnett  24:28

Sounds great. We didn’t want ever at the ATA one time. There are some law enforcement officers there. And once you start talking to them, you know, they’re just like us. Yeah, job to do. And we can kind of show our concerns and they can relate to it and then they can kind of show their side of things. And I think it was a great little meeting that we had with him.

Jeremy Paul  24:46

Yeah, I’ve got several questions. I can think I’m already

Jeremy Kellett  24:49

start writing them down. That’s right. We’ll get them ready for all Lafferty? Yeah, we’ll put him on the hot seat. That sounds great. Okay, before we before we finish up I really wanted to touch on some accidents. Because, you know, as we all know, we do all this stuff safety stuff, you know, whether it’s, I mean, the tires, the speeding the cameras, the we do it all to help ourselves and the owner operator in case of an accident. So we’d have all these measures in place to, to be able, because as a safety department and even I think like this, too, is that think of the end result? Well, what if we’re in court? You know, are we covered? Are we how do we protect ourselves and the owner operator because we have a liability insurance. So we’re gonna pay, you know, the the owner operator, he his escrows on the line. And but that’s all he pays, if it’s a half a million dollar lawsuit, if it’s a $50,000 lawsuit, he pays the first five, and then we have to cover the rest up to 250. So I just wanted to get you guys to share a couple of things about accidents. So our owner operators understand what we’re doing here. And some of the how hard it is, as a trucking company to come out on the on the good side, and we have a target on our back bull’s eye on our back. Just like the driver does, too. And we’re, we’re in it together. He his truck pull on our trailer, and we provide liability insurance. We’re trying to predict protect both of us. Absolutely steel. So what’s a couple examples you get born?

Dustin Barnett  26:26

Yeah, some examples here. But just briefly, I attended a conference a few months ago. And they’re explaining that, you know, Prosecuting Attorneys used to focus on medical malpractice, because that’s where the money was, that’s where they were receiving much their compensation. But they’ve since within the last six or seven years geared towards the trucking companies, because they see that there’s money in it. And until there’s tort reform, you know, maybe even on the federal level or more states start pushing out tort reform. Here recently, Texas, passed a bill hr 19. That was actually HB 19, where they kind of did some modifications to their judicial system. So whenever we see that nationwide, I think we’re gonna see, hopefully less and less Prosecuting Attorneys going after these

Jeremy Kellett  27:13

and as to where they can limit what what they can how much they can sue for, is that what that is, yeah,

Dustin Barnett  27:19

there’s a lot of moving parts, depending on what what gets passed. But ultimately, it does put certain caps on how much an attorney can make off a certain suit it okay. And I know here in Arkansas, we had it on the ballot last year. And then a week before we had the election, you know, they they came out said you can vote for it, but it’s not gonna count, they ended up pulling it from the ballot. And all it did was that that exact thing was limit the amount that a plaintiff’s attorney can make off a certain suit, it did not cap off or limit any, you know, medical or bodily injury payments to an individual. It was just strictly attorney. Okay, gotcha. But know that a lot of powers played a factor in that, but you could see it on the ballot, but it didn’t count if you voted. And just to give another little percentage, in one year between, you know, 17 2017 and 2018, the award for trucking related liability claims Rose 483%. And that was according to the American transport and Research Institute.

Jeremy Kellett  28:24

Golly, and that’s those were like, nuclear verdicts. Yep.

Dustin Barnett  28:30

So reason for that. So what would you consider? Jamie, I’ll ask you here. What what do you think of a nuclear verdict? What?

Jeremy Kellett  28:35

Well, it used to be millions, millions, you know, is what it used to be. And then just recently, they had one that went to a billion man. But I don’t get it. You know, there’s got to be something done about that. But used to be, you know, years ago, you hear a big company getting verdict for 10 million, 20 million, you’re like, oh, my gosh, yeah. You know, over an accident, you know, where there’s a rear end or something. And then people wonder why we get all excited. Yeah, as a company in the safety department in insurance, and it’s a big deal.

Dustin Barnett  29:15

So normally, yeah, I think the cut off now is about a million still anything over a million dollars is considered nuclear. Oh, is it but ultimately, I think of nuclear being lower than that whenever you have some minor soft tissue related claims that normally would result in about 5000 to $10,000 payout reaching upwards of 25 to $50,000. And that becoming the norm, I see that as nuclear whenever there’s not a lot of injury. There’s and we’re still paying out those kind of numbers. And I have a great example here. And I will show you some pictures just to get your opinion on it. Okay, good. So this was an accident that we had in Shreveport. We were let you look at the pictures. I gave you some backstory. So we were delivering At a customer’s facility, our owner operator missed the turn, you know, kind of stopped in the middle of the roadway, turned his flashers on, and the can some conflicting statements, but it was said that we were backing up in traffic trying to swing out wide enough to make the turn into the customer’s facility. And if you notice, I know with the just with audio, you won’t be able to see the damage. But what it is it’s a Honda a parked behind one of our dump trailers, and the only noticeable damage is on the passenger side bumper. If you look there, January, there’s a little bit of black mark from maybe already seen. Yes, yeah. A little bit of black mark, maybe from our Mudflap there. I’ll let you look at that for a second that you might be on this one on this, right? Yeah. Yeah, barely little

Jeremy Kellett  30:47

gotta pull up my specs, because I can’t even see your mark anywhere.

Dustin Barnett  30:51

So this was actually the very first trial that I attended with our owner operator. And this went to trial. It did. Yes, sir. And the reason being just because of the, you know, astronomical figures that the prosecuting attorney was putting in place and trying to get awarded, we couldn’t agree on an amount in mediation, and we had to take it to trial. And it’s an interesting process, and I know driving over the road, you never think you’re going to be put in that position. So you look at something so minor, and to reach to reach trial. And I know driving over the road, everybody always wakes up. And thanks, you know, accidents are gonna happen to me, I’m not going to be put in that position. But they do happen. And this is a prime example of what it could lead up to so just, they had about $6,000, racked up and medical. Somebody got hurt off of this. Allegedly. Yeah, there’s an alleged injury where they it was about $5,800 in medical and the majority were just chiropractic visits. They had an MRI, they were claiming bulging discs, but the MRI and stated otherwise, what do you think in court, we awarded this claim,

Jeremy Kellett  32:04

just bought a hope nothing. Wow. Yeah. But if it didn’t, like not so, I mean, I can’t see any damage on this core. And they’re saying their heart. I mean, maybe they wanted maybe 10? Grand?

Dustin Barnett  32:22

What about you? I don’t know if you’re familiar with this one. JP, what do you think

Jeremy Paul  32:25

I actually remember the accident. We’re all familiar with the process and what we all end up paying out. But that was actually my number two German about 10 to 15 years, part of what we ended up paying the claimant out. Yeah,

Dustin Barnett  32:34

yeah. So the judge awarded the claimant alone about $26,000, for her bodily injury, resulting from this claim. And in looking at it, it looks like a loss based on the figures you all thought it would be. But even more shocking, that’s not considering the cost of defense. So cost of defense to, you know, take it to trial, and all the mediations and depositions that needed to take place, the cost of defense was $66,000. Wow. And with property damage included, that’s about $94,000 was the total expense that Oakley had to incur, based on an alleged backing incident where they were

Jeremy Kellett  33:13

just out in the wild, that makes me want to throw what

Dustin Barnett  33:17

it does. And it gets frustrating over there kind of working these and seeing the cost that it takes. So even a win doesn’t always feel like it based on the amount of money we have to pay to defend these. Did

Jeremy Kellett  33:27

we get a ticket? No,

Dustin Barnett  33:29

no citation?

Jeremy Kellett  33:31

What do you have? Do you have another one?

Dustin Barnett  33:34

I don’t have any pictures of any others. But I can give you a range. So

Jeremy Kellett  33:38

you have one? As put me on the spot. You have one that was totally not our fault. And we still had to pay? Yeah,

Dustin Barnett  33:46

I can’t think of any off the top. Normally, if they’re they’re not our fault. There might be some expense costs, but I’ve never seen us actually pay out for an accent. It’s our follow me we made we have Yeah, we have. Yeah,

Jeremy Kellett  33:59

I’m sure what, what about the other one you had there.

Dustin Barnett  34:03

So just a rain. So we have that 190 1000 And then you have more when you start looking at and that’s you know, something minor, then you when you start looking at the more severe accidents that we’ve had where there is some negligence, maybe on our owner operators part and, and one that comes to mind was a $3.5 million payout for a rear end accident where our owner operator just, you know, was somehow distracted, wasn’t paying attention and caused a rear end accident. And that just kind of shows the range from from minor to severe. And I tell you, his people were hurt. Yeah. So there was a some brain injury involved in that when the calls went to

Jeremy Kellett  34:39

trial. Yeah. Wow. Or did that even go to trial? That one? That one I think we just said I don’t think that one. Well, it gets out of our hands at that point. It’s good. It’s in the insurance attorneys hands because yeah, we’re we’re you know, you first you lose the owner operator loses 5000 Then we pay up to 255 When Correct? Yeah, and then insurance picks up

Dustin Barnett  35:02

after that. Yeah. And that’s important to know, you hear a lot of well, insurance covers that. So there’s a lot of factors in play. So with a self insured retention Oakley really incurs a lot of that front end cost. Yeah, for these accidents, and then even beyond that, it you might not be paying out, as far as you know, when it reaches in to the millions, but you ultimately do because it affects your insurance rates, it affects the likeliness to you obtaining liability insurance, because all of these claims get factored in. Yeah, whenever they rewrite here,

Jeremy Kellett  35:33

that’s a whole nother podcast. Yeah. You start getting into what what’s, you know, what’s happened this past year? What’s settled? What happened? What’s still hanging out there for years? Now, don’t guess you know, how long that the time from that accident happened? I’m talking about this, this small one that cost 97,000. The time The accident happened until the actual trial. And it settled?

Dustin Barnett  35:56

I think it was it happened in 17. And I think it was in 19 that it

Jeremy Kellett  36:00

ended up so just drag it out. Keep dragging it. Oh, yeah, it

Dustin Barnett  36:04

does. And that’s expenses keep dragging out as well. Well,

Jeremy Kellett  36:09

I told JP when we come in here, so if we talk about bad stuff first, and we’ll end on a good positive note. So I don’t know that. That’s it. Note JP, you got a positive information for us to end up end up,

Jeremy Paul  36:21

I did have some positive information going back to our CSA, you know, it was many owner operators, we get out there. As much as you know, many inspections we do get, we’re looking at 66% of our owner operators have zero CSI points. And that’s, that’s a fantastic, fantastic number. And then you’ve got 22% at one to 15, which is still good 16 to 37.6%. So that’s some really good numbers there to see. Yeah, yeah,

Jeremy Kellett  36:47

we got some great owner operators, you know, you that take care of us every day that represent us well, every day that, you know, are very safety minded. And you can tell by getting them in here and talking to them. I mean, as you’re doing putting these new, new cameras in, I mean, we got some great guys that are taking care of us. Thank goodness, you know, and that starts on the front end, referring guys here and going through going, you know, putting the right guy to work here, you know, making sure we’re particular on who we who release on and staying consistent with that, you know, not dropping our standards, we got to continue to be consistent with that. And then it produces good people and good site driver, and that’s what we’re after. Absolutely. Well, appreciate is that all you guys got?

Jeremy Paul  37:32

Thanks. I think that’s all I have. I think that’s it and I just want to say a quick reminder out so you know our quarterly videos Syndics videos are going going back out and right now Alex Ryan, Cal Haney and Garrett. Their owner operators are on our quarterly list for this key one, so be expecting those to come out.

Jeremy Kellett  37:50

Okay, good deal. Well, thank you guys for joining me and doing this episode. I like it. You’re very informative. I think it was good information that’ll help our owner operators do their job better every day and think about the big picture a little bit. All right, appreciate everybody joining the Oakley podcast. Once again. Don’t forget we come out every week with a new one every Wednesday and we will make sure we get it out to everybody. And please be sure to subscribe, like and comment on all our videos. It helps tremendously. Once again, appreciate it. We’ll talk to you next week. Thanks. Thanks for listening to this episode with Oakley podcast, trucking, business and family. If you enjoyed this episode, be sure to rate or review the show in the podcast platform of your choice and share it with a friend. We love hearing from our audience. So if you’ve got a question, comment or just want to say hello, head over to our website, the Oakley podcast.com and click the leave a comment button. We’ll get you a response soon and may even share some of the best ones here on the show. We’ll be back with a fresh episode very soon. Thanks for listening